"If you own gold, you are in a war"

General discussion on movement in the markets, underlying causes/factors. Post an interesting article or commentary.

Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:12 am

If money be not thy servant, it will be thy master. The covetous man cannot so properly be said to possess wealth, as that it may be said to possess him.--BACON



Thanks to our friend W.G. for pointing out a fascinating article written for Harper's magazine in November 1983 about the Bank for International Settlements by the veteran journalist Edward Jay Epstein, who seems to have been given unusual access to top BIS officials. Epstein's article shows the BIS running the world financial system almost entirely in secret and, in the process, frequently intervening in the gold market or making gold available to arbitrageurs as part of a general system of currency market regulation -- and swapping gold particularly as part of a policy of supporting the U.S. dollar.

Of course this was 27 years ago and the BIS couldn't possibly be part of such things anymore, could it? After all, Kitco senior market analyst Jon Nadler says central banks have no motive to manipulate the gold market, and CPM Group executive Jeff Christian says central bankers hardly ever think about gold. (That would explain why they have chosen him as their gold consultant.)

Epstein's article is headlined "Ruling the World of Money" and you can find it in the archive of his Internet site here:
Ten times a year— once a mouth except in August and October— a small elite of well dressed men arrives in Basel, Switzerland. Carrying overnight bags and attache cases, they discreetly check into the Euler Hotel, across from the railroad station. They have come to this sleepy city from places as disparate as Tokyo, London, and Washington, D.C., for the regular meeting of the most exclusive, secretive, and powerful supranational club in the world. The profits earned just from renting out its hoard of gold (second only to that of Fort Knox in value) are more than sufficient to pay for the expenses of the entire organization. And the unabashed purpose of its elite monthly meetings is to coordinate and, if possible, to control all monetary activities in the industrialized world.

http://www.edwardjayepstein.com/archived/moneyclub.htm

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"If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby Entendance on Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:15 am

A blizzard of paperwork could be about to hit numismatics.
Passage by Congress of the national health care legislation has had an unintended consequence to the nation’s coin collectors, vest-pocket dealers who buy and sell coins, and larger dealers who are frequent buyers of coins that collectors periodically liquidate as they trade up their collections for better coins, or simply sell to take a small profit or loss.
What has happened is that effective Jan. 1, 2012, the whole system of giving and receiving Internal Revenue Service 1099 forms will be turned on its head and all persons (including corporations) who are in business will now have to give 1099 tax reporting forms for coins and other goods that they sell as well as buy...
:o :( :arrow: http://tinyurl.com/28muo6x


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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby GSIMMERLE on Fri Jul 16, 2010 11:57 am

There are some crocodile tears over at the 50th floor of 1251 Avenue of the Americas this morning. With a holding of 168 million shares of BAC and 506 million in Citi, Paulson and Co. is down nearly $300 million on just its top two positions alone. When one adds the other top ten positions, which include $3.5 billion worth of GLD, as well as massive positions in ANG, CMCSA, STI, TRE, RIO, BSC, COF, WFC, MGM and many others, it is not surprising that the market is rife with rumors that the once vaunted bearish and now very much bullish hedge fund manager (who according to Goldman's carefully crafted settlement press release yesterday, only achieved his subprime-related wealth due to prospectus misrepresentations by Goldman, which is now permanently in the public record) is down about $1 billion for the day so far. Of course, on a NAV of $31 billion this is not all that big, but likely will not help with the recent surge in redemption requests.... Or the need for liquidations...
http://tinyurl.com/37eyubx
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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:29 pm

Ron Paul Silver Ounces Accepted at Michigan Gas Station; Chiropractor Accepts Gold, Silver, Apple Pie; Back to the Stone Age; Chickens Invade Lansing

Here's four interesting ways businesses, private citizens, and counties are coping with the economic depression. The first is the most important one. Let's hope it catches on.

Gold, Silver, Copper, Freely Accepted as Money



http://tinyurl.com/242yheq

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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Tue Jul 20, 2010 9:30 pm

Richard Russell last night…

At this juncture, sophisticated, wealthy people are not concerned with increasing their fortunes, rather they are searching for ways to conserve their wealth. They view the future as a bevy of fortune-busting phenomena. These include a deflationary atmosphere, higher (punitive) state and federal taxes, a socialist government, a cut in entitlements, rising medical and tuition bills, a strongly anti-gold attitude by the Fed and the government.

The anti-gold attitude will be part of the Fed's effort to force investors to remain in fiat money. The Fed and the government want the American people to live with fiat money and without the protection of gold. Finally, the authorities do not want to deal with the anti-dollar signal that rising gold would advertise to the world. The fraud of fiat money must, at all costs, remain a secret.

But remember, the US public is not totally stupid, they would realize that rising gold means the dollar's loss of purchasing power (think the Tea-party).

Question -- How far do you think the government (and the Fed) will go in their battle against gold? Do you think the government will try to ban or confiscate gold as they did in 1933?

Answer -- I doubt if the government will pull a "1933" again? But frankly, I wouldn't trust the Obama administration to keep their socialist hands off our gold. Already the IRS is trying to kill gold with taxes -- the IRS treats any variety of gold investment as a commodity subject to taxes as if it was current income. Next, the IRS may try to tax all gold coin holdings.

A final thought in this area. The US government has had a policy through many years of distributing gold coins (American Eagles) to the populace. It's hard to believe that after years of distributing gold, the government would turn around and try to confiscate that same gold. But I don't put anything past this government. Further, if ordered to turn their gold in as happened in 1933, I doubt if most Americans would obey. I just doubt if most Americans would passively follow the government's orders. These are not the same law-abiding Americans that existed in the early 1930s.

This big picture is one reason why wealthy Americans have been diversifying their safe-haven items. Diamond prices are sky-high as are auction prices for favored art. Some wealthy people are buying classic cars at fat prices, others are paying top prices for rare antiques and collectibles.

Remember, fiat money is the source of the Fed's power. Gold is the people's protection against the Fed's destruction of our currency. All this has given way to "biflation," inflation of safe haven items and deflation in consumer products…




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Will Gold Miners Act Like Stocks or Gold During the Crash?

Postby Entendance on Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:30 am

Entendance wrote:on Tue Jul 20, 2010 4:44 am
Entendance wrote:on Fri Jun 25, 2010 3:51 am :o :? Will Gold Miners Act Like Stocks or Gold During the Crash?
:roll: :arrow: http://tinyurl.com/39gjn7v


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:o :? According to our interpretation of the charts if you fall for this spin you are going to get seriously fleeced in short order, and this could also apply to those who listen to the siren calls of those exhorting the virtues of Precious Metals stocks at this time. So let’s make this as clear as possible - if there is another market crash soon as expected, investors are going to do what they always do, which is go into blind panic and toss almost everything overboard, and that can be expected to include gold, silver and PM stocks. Yes, we fully understand that the fiat money system is rapidly approaching its nemesis and that gold is the ultimate safe haven and is set to soar as currencies become worthless, but that won’t help it much short-term during the crash phase, which is likely to result in a heavy reaction in gold back probably to its long-term uptrend support line. Silver will be treated as a base metal and will plunge precipitously as in 2008, which it is now perfectly set up to do. PM stocks will tank and many PM stock investors will be devastated as their cheerleaders slink into the shadows. All of this looks very, very close.
Think I’m joking, or have “lost my marbles”? - it’s time for a little mental exercise then. Take a look at the 2 charts below, one a 2-year chart for the S&P500 index and the other a 3-year chart for the large PM stock XAU index...
What's Gonna Happen Next? Charts :arrow: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=563&p=11539#p11539

Jesse's take :arrow: http://tinyurl.com/36evsxw


It would appear that the euphoria over gold has quickly diminished and many of gold’s greatest proponents, who were calling for gold to go over $2,000 an ounce, appear to be disheartened and shell-shocked by the recent sharp downturn in gold.
There’s an old adage in trading and it goes like this, “they slide faster than they glide.” This is true of all markets and what it means is they go down faster than they go up...

Is it time to buy gold?
VIDEO :arrow: http://tinyurl.com/36pyr9b


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“A hard rain lies ahead” :roll: :arrow: http://tinyurl.com/23bwxr7
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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Wed Jul 21, 2010 1:42 pm

Hmmm...is there a legitimate concern for the public here or are they concerned with what's on the public's mind?


Gold Coin Sellers Angered by New Tax Law
Amendment Slipped Into Health Care Legislation Would Track, Tax Coin and Bullion Transactions


Those already outraged by the president's health care legislation now have a new bone of contention -- a scarcely noticed tack-on provision to the law that puts gold coin buyers and sellers under closer government scrutiny.


http://tinyurl.com/2e8azux


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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:46 pm

Will the GLD ETF'S be your golden fleece http://tinyurl.com/rpwor or will they fleece (rip off) your gold?

The Daily Reckoning…

That's right, gold. You know, the ultimate money. Or Gold: The Once and Future Money, as our friend Nathan Lewis titled his 2007 book, for which we were privileged to write the foreword.

Hey, Wall Street can take a $250 million sewer project in Alabama and turn it into an insurmountable debt 20 times as big. So it can find a way to pervert the Midas metal, too. And the evidence is piling up: You don't have to be partial to conspiracy theories about the "manipulation" of gold to conclude something just doesn't look right.

That means you need to be very careful about how you hold any gold outside your physical possession - especially in a retirement account.

Of course, it's always important to ask oneself, how much is there to these conspiracy theories, really? Well, ever since the publication of his book, Lewis has been scrutinizing them. And this year, they've reached a fever pitch.

* Did you hear about the 400-ounce gold bars filled with tungsten? (Tungsten's weight is nearly identical to gold, so the deception is simple if the bar isn't properly assayed)

* Or the one about the London metals trader turned whistle-blower who alleged JP Morgan Chase is suppressing the silver price? And how he was injured in a mysterious hit-and-run? (His injuries were minor)

* Or how the head of the Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee testified about gold manipulation before the Commodity Futures Tradition Commission and the camera conveniently malfunctioned?

You could go very far down the rabbit hole trying to separate fact from fiction with these kind of stories. And you'd be wasting your time.

Marc Faber, editor of The Gloom Boom & Doom Report stated it well in April, so well we quoted it in The 5 Min. Forecast: "If you have manipulation to keep the price down, it eventually goes ballistic. So all the people that are bitching about the manipulation of silver and gold should be happy that it is manipulated, because it still gives them an opportunity to buy it at a depressed price."

Exactly. Manipulation stories are a source of entertainment, outrage or both. They underscore the perils of the Wall Street Fandango. But their truth or falsehood makes little difference if you hold gold in your physical possession. Or in an allocated account (the gold has your name on it) in an independent, insured depository. Or if you use a reputable electronic gold purveyor. (We like GoldMoney.com and BullionVault.com.)

But it makes a lot of difference if you hold "paper gold" in the form of an exchange-traded fund. Many people buy vehicles like GLD and IAU with the comforting illusion that what they're buying is "good as gold." And it's an incredibly convenient way to get metals exposure in a retirement account.

Which brings us to the revelations of Janet Tavakoli.

Tavakoli is not a gold bug. She's an expert in structured finance and credit derivatives who runs her own consulting firm in Chicago. Recently, she published a client report that took the format of "advice" she would give to Wall Street sharpies trying to corner the gold market. Not that they'd ever try that, of course.

Pump up the gold story. Get your friends to tell retail investors to buy some gold every month. Get your buddies in the financial business to offer exchange-traded gold funds (ETFs) that claim to buy physical gold. This will sound safe to retail investors, but in fact, the ETFs are very risky. This will serve your purpose when you are ready to start a panic. These particular ETFs will allow the "gold" to be commingled with the custodian's gold, and the custodian can lease out the gold.

Moreover, the "gold" custodian can give it to a subcustodian that the manager doesn't know. The subcustodian can give it to yet another subcustodian unknown to the original custodian. The manager will never audit the gold, and the gold is not "allocated" to a particular investor. Since this is an "exchange traded" gold fund, investors will probably assume the gold is regulated by the Commodities Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), but it isn't. By the time investors wake up to the probability that there is very little actual gold backing their investment, your plan will be ready to execute.

The "plan" involves buying huge futures contracts and expecting physical delivery. If this sounds familiar, it's pretty much what the Hunt brothers did when they tried to corner the silver market in 1980. Silver shot up to $50, however briefly. It's never seen that territory again.

But the consequences this time around would be far more serious. It could collapse banks holding huge short positions in the futures market, accustomed to settling contracts cash only. More to our point, it would crater the ETFs: Their complex network of custodians and subcustodians would be laid bare. ETF investors would realize they have a claim on the same chunk of gold as, say, Goldman Sachs. But Goldman would have the actual metal. The ETF investor would have to settle for pennies on the dollar.

Far-fetched? Maybe. Just remember that ETFs are ultimately, like a complicated mortgage derivative, subject to counterparty risk. If the day comes when trust evaporates from the system, value will evaporate from the ETFs. If you want to play gold's short-term ups and downs, the ETFs are an ideal instrument. Otherwise, stay away.

Addison Wiggin, for The Daily Reckoning


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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Sat Jul 31, 2010 4:55 pm

Max wants to go after the LBMA....

[OTE65] On the Edge with Jim Willie



http://tinyurl.com/284sb4h

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Re: "If you own gold, you are in a war"

Postby dlry on Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:06 pm

Useless metal?................People forget why people over the ages have lusted over gold...because it has value....monetary value

Listen....

Wednesday, August 4, 2010

Pierre Lassonde is one of the living legends of the mining and resource world with over 35 years of experience. His accomplishments are simply too many to list, but one example is Pierre is current Chairman of Franco-Nevada and co-founded Franco-Nevada Mining Corporation with Seymour Schulich in 1982 and over a 20 year period, provided shareholders with a 36% annualized rate of return. He was able to build up and successfully merge Franco Nevada into Newmont Mining in what was essentially a depression in the mining sector. It was the worst of times, but somehow in the midst of those horrific industry conditions Pierre and everyone associated with him thrived and quite frankly made fortunes. Pierre then became President of Newmont Mining Corporation from 2002 to 2006. Another area where Pierre is becoming legendary is in the area of philanthropy and that is a tremendous passion for him at this point in his life.



http://tinyurl.com/33xzgoa


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